Restoring Balance and Rebuilding Trust: The Holistic Recovery Journey at Domus Retreat

In this emotionally charged episode, the Waismann Method® Podcast takes you inside Domus Retreat, where post-detox recovery transforms lives. Join host Dwight Hurst, Clare Waismann, David Livingston, and special guest Jaman Eley, as they dive into the heart of healing and uncover the intricacies of restoring balance after opioid dependence. Through expert insights and decades of experience, discover how Domus Retreat provides individualized care that goes beyond detox, fostering physical, emotional, and psychological recovery. This episode will leave you inspired by stories of resilience, armed with knowledge, and eager to explore the real meaning of recovery.

Tune in as we explore the critical role of trust, physical healing, and emotional stability in ensuring a successful recovery journey. Whether you’re battling addiction, supporting a loved one, or seeking answers, this conversation offers a compassionate and thorough roadmap to long-lasting wellness.

Podcast Episode Summary:

1. Inside the Post-Detox Journey – Learn why recovery begins after detox and how Domus Retreat’s comprehensive care rebalances the body and mind, focusing on physical and emotional restoration.
2. The Importance of a Safe Space – Discover how Domus creates a non-judgmental environment where patients are empowered to regain trust in themselves and embrace their healing journey without fear or pressure.
3. Individualized Care for Long-Term Success – Hear from Jaman Eley, LVN, as he explains how every treatment plan at Domus is crafted to meet the unique physical and emotional needs of each patient, ensuring a personal path to wellness.
4. Overcoming the Stigma of Addiction – Clare Waismann and David Livingston share how compassion, experience, and a thorough understanding of addiction pave the way for effective recovery, leaving behind outdated methods that focus only on detox.
5. The Power of Support in Recovery – Learn why professional, medical, and psychological support at Domus Retreat can make the difference between relapse and a successful long-term recovery. The team shares real-life stories of transformation that will inspire hope and action.

Transcript:

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: Hello everybody and welcome back to a podcast to answer your questions on addiction recovery and mental health by Waismann Method Treatment Center and Rapid Detox. I’m Dwight Hurst. I’m a clinical mental health counselor and also lucky enough and privileged enough to be the co-host for this program. Uh, great to be here in spirit with all of you listeners out there and to be here in actuality with our wonderful panel of experts today. So let’s go around and meet all of us first. We have Clare Waismann, who’s a registered addiction specialist and the creator and founder of both the Waismann Method Opioid Detoxification Specialists and also Domus Retreat for aftercare, which, by the way, is what we’re going to be focused on today.

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: Uh, excitingly enough, I’m also joined, of course, by David Livingston, our clinical lead and therapist for the program. David’s a licensed marriage and family therapist and an experienced and expert in the field of psychotherapy, and especially as regards mental health and the underlying psychological needs that come with addiction treatment. Um, we have a wonderful special guest who’s with us today. In fact, you’re with us every day as it as it happens when it comes to to Waismann Method, a big, big part of Waismann Method is Jaman Eley, who’s a licensed vocational nurse and a drug and alcohol counselor with over 25 years of experience. And thank goodness for us. 18 or so of those years have been here with Waismann and helped to shape that program, particularly in the Domus Retreat. Um, we were just as we’re talking as we’re getting ready for this to I was my first chance to meet you, Jaman, and was so impressed by your commitment to independent, individualized treatment, which is a big part for anyone who’s ever listened to this show. A big part of the way that, uh, the way that we do treatment and the way that we advocate for people to receive treatment. Uh. Welcome, everybody.

Jaman Eley, LVN, SUDCC II, MATCC: Thank you. Thank you.

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: How’s everyone today?

Jaman Eley, LVN, SUDCC II, MATCC: Doing well. Feeling good.

David B. Livingston, LMFT: That’s good. Yeah, definitely. And and, um, so happy to have Jaman on. Uh. Thank you. Thank you. I will have more to say about that later, but let’s just start with that.

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: Well, the the topic of today is talking about restoring balance and rebuilding trust and a holistic approach to recovery. And particularly we’re going to focus a little bit on the Domus Retreat, uh, which is going to be a great opportunity for us to showcase what we do with treatment through Waismann. But this also as everything that we talk about applies out there generally to for anybody who is working in treatment or seeking after treatment, these are the things that we strongly advise that you’re going to want to look for is these elements of treatment that we’re going to be talking about today. Um, specifically, we’re focusing on the physical and emotional elements of recovery and the way that we try to approach all of the different needs, whether it be sleep restoration, uh, gut health, working with the knowledge of neurotransmitters and different kind of hormonal balancing, um, the physiological side, as well as the psychological part of maintaining emotional stability, getting empowered, and just all of the things that come crashing down and happening to people, uh, the wonderful, jarring, traumatic world that is recovery. There we go. That’s a that’s a big old way to introduce it, right?

Clare Waismann, M-RAS/SUDCC II: It was very well put.

Jaman Eley, LVN, SUDCC II, MATCC: Yes, yes.

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: Uh, so let’s let’s dive right in and talk about, uh, you know, the central components to, to what we do through Domus. Uh, Jaman starting out, uh, what do you think makes the the post-detox recovery so different? And so kind of like, like as its own thing after someone has gone through detox.

Jaman Eley, LVN, SUDCC II, MATCC: Oh, well, uh, the difference with our program is essentially that the detox happens over the course of days, as opposed to traditional programs where there’s 30 or 60 or 90 days. Um, so when the client comes over to us, their life is just changed in a matter of days. And so we have to help them to catch up to what’s just happened to them. So both physically and emotionally, because they have been on the run, um, and not taking care of themselves physically, not dealing with their emotions. So it gives them a chance to kind of sit down and breathe and develop a plan, uh, to figure out what the next step is going to be, what recovery for them is actually going to look like. Um, so it’s a crucial step in planting those seeds of success for our clients. Um, and, uh, is it can be overwhelming for the client? Um, so it’s good for them not to have to rush back to their busy schedules and hectic lives and and try to maintain while they’re figuring out that next direction for themselves. And so it’s crucially important, in my opinion.

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: Yeah. The interesting thing is whenever we look at doing something, I think that people sometimes think of detoxification as a goal instead of the start of a goal, right? This is a step one. You say, I’m going to go to get detox. Great. Now what? You know when when you get out, you just go home to the same things. And so often in addiction, we think that stabilization means I just stop ingesting the, the drug of choice, and then I’m good. And it’s like, no. Then I’m actually in most need of all for probably the, the highest need that I’ve been in for a long time. As far as exactly new stuff. Yeah. Excellent. Let’s, uh, let’s focus first a little bit on some of that physical and physiological, uh, restoration. And I’ll throw this out to everybody. What are some of the important parts of rebalancing the body and the connection that people have with their own bodies?

Clare Waismann, M-RAS/SUDCC II: Yeah, I think Jaman can speak about the not just the long term and what recovery is going to look like. But once they are detoxed, their hormones are all over the place. You know, they don’t have sleep patterns. Um, their emotions are all over the place. Um, opioids are drugs that do not allow you to retain fluids. What that means is any organ, especially gastrointestinal, that works with fluids, you know, is being, you know, um, overflowing with fluids. And, um, they need adjustment. And family members, um, cannot help them. Uh, sometimes family members can cause them more anxiety. So a lot of, uh, different medical detox, um, offered them a fast way to come off drugs, but then send them to a hotel room or back to the family members. And, you know, it’s it’s a recipe for disaster. You, as Jaman said, it’s a critical phase of adjustment, not just physical, but emotional as well. It is important that they have professionals with them to assist, to guide them, to give them that security. That is going to be okay. Um, being out there. It’s not just dangerous, uh, physically for them, but also these are people that at any time they feel discomfort, they feel scared or angry. Their first approach is, let me numb this feeling. So the, um, the possibilities of relapse is much, much higher, um, offering them a place to be where they can get the support they need and the supportive medications they need to make that process not just much more comfortable, but safer for them, is of the utmost importance. And Jaman can talk a bit about that because we do get calls from hotel rooms, you know, from homes. What do I do? What do I do from places that do send them home right away?

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: I knew of a place in my area working with with clients. I heard stories of this place and I think it was well-intentioned. Uh, it was somebody who owned a campground. So think of where I’m going with this. I, uh, there was someone who was in recovery themselves who owned this campground, and they basically they had made it open to anybody who didn’t have a place to stay and couldn’t pay. They could camp there, which, hey, that’s great. But there everybody knew that. Boy, if you need to detox, they’ll give you a space to go set up your tent and go in there with a blanket and a bucket or something. And it’s like, okay, not only are we not kind of tending to the needs, it’s like you could just, like, die out there in the wilderness by yourself. Once again, well-intentioned, but people don’t realize how important this physical restabilization and monitoring even is to to monitor your health, right?

Jaman Eley, LVN, SUDCC II, MATCC: Absolutely, absolutely. I’m in full agreement with you. Well, what happens a lot of the times is, uh, when a person is in recovery themselves, they think that the way that they got clean is the only way to get clean. And so they try to force that on another person, and it can be dangerous. Um, when you have these programs where they detox you and send you to a hotel room with a bag of medications, and, you know, your girlfriend who doesn’t understand addiction, who has been letting you get away with bloody murder for who knows how long. And, uh, it can be a recipe for disaster for those people. That’s why I feel that Domus Retreat is so important. Um, the emotional side, of course. But those crucial first days when they definitely need to be monitored to make sure that there is no complications because as we were talking about, everybody is an individual and what works for one person may be detrimental to another, so they need to be monitored by medical professionals just to get them to the other side of it and make sure that everything is everything.

David B. Livingston, LMFT: That’s well said. Um, working with Jaman and Doctor Lowenstein, um, and we had between the three of us and Clare. Um, we have we have decades of experience. We know how to differentiate between what may be psychological and physiological. We know how to look for specific signs and problems and address it. So you need a lot of experience and knowledge because, um, because opioids regulate so many systems. You have so many systems that are dysregulated right after a detox. So you need to know how to think about and differentiate what’s going on specifically. And if you don’t know how to think about that and don’t know what to listen for and don’t see where the vulnerabilities are, um, there’s problems. And then the way that ties in emotionally is that as soon as they don’t feel like as soon as the patient doesn’t feel like you’re understanding what they need, and you can’t talk to them and listen to them and articulate it and work towards fixing it, their anxiety goes up. They lose confidence. They often get a, um, you know, um, you know, they’ll even at times start talking about cravings because they’re, they’re, they’re feeling sort of trapped in what they’re doing. So a lot of what we do, and I think the decades we have treating people is, um, we really pay attention? I talked to Jaman and we talked with Doctor Lowenstein, Clare, and everybody sort of works together as a team until we figure out how to get the person feeling better, what their needs are. And, um, you know, and as we can convey that and as it’s accurate enough, people actually get better, not only physiologically but also emotionally.

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: If I have been, if I put myself in the shoes of someone who’s, you know, let’s say that I’ve been having opioid dependence for some remarkable, some, some significant amount of time. We’re talking multiple years, maybe ten, 20 years, or even more. I may find that I don’t know my body and know my emotions as having the same experience sober as I did 20 years ago. Like like I come out of that and just just because of the experiences of addiction, but also just because I’m 20 years older, uh, I may have a whole different experience that I have literally never had before. I wonder if if y’all could talk a little bit about that adjustment that people have having to rediscover or rather discover this new self?

Clare Waismann, M-RAS/SUDCC II: I think, you know, it’s funny you say that because it is often a question we get, you know, am I going to feel like I felt before I started using drugs? And then I asked him, I, you know, when did you start using drugs? 15 years ago. 20 years ago. And I tell them, I don’t feel like I used to feel ten years ago. Five years ago. You know, I have a lot more pains. I have a lot more, you know, uh, lack of, you know, ability to deal with things and, you know, lack of memory. I mean, obviously, you get older and your body, you know, feels older. So I tell them, we are going to get you where you are without the numbing device masking how you should be feeling. So whoever you are, whatever you are at this point is what we’re going to unmask and work with you.

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: It’s a great point because yeah, at that point, I’ve been the nature of opioid addiction is that is that we’re taking a numbing agent, a painkiller, right? And so the pains that are being felt might be opioid-induced hyperalgesia of some kind, or it’s causing its own kind of pain, or it’s numbing the pains that I might otherwise be feeling. And so yeah, there’s going to be surprises maybe to be found when we get off of that. What about that adjustment period? Yeah. Go ahead David.

David B. Livingston, LMFT: I was going to say, um, I have a we all have a strong sense of what’s going to lead to the, to getting better, right? We know what the steps are. So when something is outside of that, you know, one of my jobs is to understand that isn’t necessarily part of the physiology of early recovery from a detox. And so I’ll address that separately. Um, because they can’t tell. Right. You know, there’s so much going on, um, initially that they can’t tell. So part of what we do is, you know, and, and really what decades of experience is, is we know the way forward. And so if, if the person isn’t sleeping, we know that there’s going to be heightened anxiety usually. There’s going to be more fatigue. They’re going to have some brain fog. We’ll work with Jaman, work with Doctor Lowenstein. We’ll go through the history if they have, you know, sleep problems. We’ll see what medications have been effective or ineffective. So there’s a whole process of getting them and understanding that what it is, it’s going to take that. And because sleep regulates so much, it’s one of the most important things we focus on. And there’s no point in not sleeping. So we’ll use medications and so forth to get them feeling better as quickly as possible, because as they do, they’re more resilient. They’re healthier, their recovery moves faster. It’s really, um, so, you know, so to be more specific about sort of the course forward and how we look at things, and I do this with Jaman all the time. So um, and then we do it with Doctor Lowenstein. So it’s, you know, just to give an example.

Jaman Eley, LVN, SUDCC II, MATCC: Yeah. And if I could add to that, uh, the unique thing about our program is that, uh, most when people come in, of course, the doctor assesses what their needs are. If they were taking medications prior to coming to us, and we make sure that those medications are in place, but the medications that are added are just for a brief period of time. We don’t. We very rarely have set times that the medication is supposed to be taken, because we don’t want them thinking, it’s 3:00, it’s time to take another pill. We want them to identify what they’re feeling, how they’re feeling, where that feeling came from. Is it something that they they need to address physically? Is it something that they need to address emotionally so they’re not caught up in this just transferring from one substance to another substance still that a lot of programs will do and not to, uh, you know, badmouth any other programs. They all have their uniqueness. But in our way of thinking, we want the client to deal with how they’re feeling, um, and address that, meet that where it is and not just take a pill because it’s 3:00, you know, and I think it’s a lot more effective that way for when they get back into their real lives, um, that they’re not attached to, you know, that schedule and, uh, with 15 pills that they’re taking a day unnecessarily.

David B. Livingston, LMFT: Right, exactly. I’ll just add to that. I mean, so part of what I do Jaman does and Doctor Lowenstein does is we really try to differentiate and talk to them about what medications are medicinal temporarily. Right, so that they act to move them towards health. You know, in the in the end the whole goal is health. That’s that’s the goal. The goal is. So there are medications initially that actually move them towards health quickly. Okay. And then with the perspective that that’s the goal of it. And therefore you minimize, uh, suffering that isn’t necessary, which is why wouldn’t you without the dangers of getting them hooked on or, you know, other medications with any long term effect. And so we try to get them as well as quickly as possible understanding, you know, the limits of that.

Clare Waismann, M-RAS/SUDCC II: And I think what Jaman said as well is incredibly important because we spoke about before that the patients want to be heard, uh, want to want to be understood by us. But I think it’s incredibly important that they hear they learn to hear their own bodies and understand their own bodies. Uh, as much as they expect the world to do so, they have to learn as well to do so and not fall on that, you know, chronic, repetitive motion of day by day.

David B. Livingston, LMFT: Right. And that, that so part of what drives compulsivity addiction, whatever anybody wants to call it is when people can’t see another way forward and they’re unable to differentiate their symptoms from, you know, and when you’re on a long-term opioid because it regulates everything, you stop understanding other potential ways to get where you need to be. So as we begin to outline that right. Okay, I’m feeling badly. Well, here’s the reasons. It’s not what you’re thinking. It’s this and this. And then they can feel that. And it begins to, um, you know, and as we treat it, it gets better. There’s a whole shift in the way they’re thinking again, it goes away from an opioid as the only way to regulate a system to multiple ways to regulate a system that are healthier. And that’s a that’s a big part of what we do at Domus.

Jaman Eley, LVN, SUDCC II, MATCC: Yes, yes.

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: Really important to have a safe environment then to be able to do that because we’re talking about Open, honest, non-judgmental communication both with patients and care, but also for that person within themselves to be communicating and being honest with themselves too. And so it’s important to maintain that environment of care, concern and safety, emotional safety for people. Right.

David B. Livingston, LMFT: That’s the bottom line. And Clare and Jaman are just unbelievable at this. And, um, is that we’re actually interested in them getting well and getting better. And that is the goal period. The goal is to get them well with this, um, safely and as quickly as possible. And why not? There’s there’s no need for, you know, um, suffering that doesn’t lead to something better, right? So if you can, you know, and there’s limits to that. I’m not trying to sort of create some picture that there, you know, there’s no way to get off opioids without some discomfort. There’s no way. Um, but within that, you can minimize it if you understand what the needs are.

Jaman Eley, LVN, SUDCC II, MATCC: Absolutely.

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: What kinds of things are important to sort of prep people for, uh, as they’re there for such a short time? It’s such a it sounds like we’re talking about individualizing and helping people. Sort of. They take that first step of detox, they’re making a treatment plan, a recovery plan. They’re kicking off this. They go back out into the world. And what do we do to prep them for that?

Jaman Eley, LVN, SUDCC II, MATCC: Well, first we if I can, uh, first we have to meet them with where they are. Everybody has a plan. Whether it’s a good plan or a bad plan, everybody comes with a plan. And so we have to identify what they think needs to happen. Right? Uh, first, give them that. That time to breathe. Um, like we were talking about before, um, give them that time to physically reregulate. And then we ease into that plan, and we don’t have a lot of time to work on it, but we want them to be doing what it is that they want to do. If we’re trying to fit them into a box or force them to do 12 steps or, uh, get a psychiatrist or a psychologist and they’re not into those types of things, then they’re not going to be successful with them. So we want to identify what their plan is and then work with them to gain that out, to see what that looks like as they move forward. And we have to tell them the reality of the world is that once they leave. The world hasn’t changed. So those same stressors, though, that same chaos, is still out there waiting for you. And you need to be prepared for that. Right. And so that’s that leads to those motivations why they’re with us in the first place. So if they if we can help them to feel better, to give them that time to reregulate and breathe. Then we work on that plan and we help them as best we can. If it takes making a phone call for them or getting on the computer for them, we help them in every way we can to have that plan in place when they return to their home lives.

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: A big word that came to my mind as you’re saying, that is respect, right? Giving the people the respect not only to offer good treatment and to tailor that. But you talk about basically asking, say, what is your plan? And then respecting that plan because, because even if I have a bad plan, I want someone to respect that I have one.

Jaman Eley, LVN, SUDCC II, MATCC: Absolutely!

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: Care about me and respect me as an individual, right? Which, by the way, coming through addiction at the point where you come into treatment, I’m not used to people. There’s maybe a lot of people in my life who don’t respect me very much and are not, are not giving me that that credibility to to have that expertise in my own life. And so that’s a huge thing.

Jaman Eley, LVN, SUDCC II, MATCC: Especially, yeah, the population that we’re working with. Um, a lot of times, even when a person has a bad plan, when it’s in their head, it makes sense. And so they keep rolling it around and rolling it around and it’s going to work. But it’s the moment that they put it out into the universe, and they can hear it themselves with their own ears, then they can identify that. Maybe not. Maybe we should move in a different direction.

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: Well, that gets right into one of the things I want to make sure to hit, uh, which is a question really for, for everybody. I want to hear everyone’s feedback on what equals success. Uh, for with all this individualization that we do with people, uh, what is maybe an important factor in, in being successful or how should people, like, measure their own success and define that.

David B. Livingston, LMFT: Anybody want to go? I can go.

Clare Waismann, M-RAS/SUDCC II: You go.

David B. Livingston, LMFT: First. Well, um. All all plans are good and bad to some degree. Okay. And I’ll. Okay. Because, um, so I’ll, I’ll take that back a little bit. Um, the thing that I stress is getting into therapy and if, if needed, um, uh, you know, a psychiatrist to help with sleep or other issues that may be more driven physiologically. And so I’ll take a history and I’ll ask him about those things to see what their history is, because as Jaman and Clare are pointing out, you know, what was there before will be there again. So if they have a history of insomnia, which tons of people do, the idea that, you know, and, um, opioids tend to help with that. So when you’re off of them, if you’ve got a long history of that, then it’ll tend to, there’s a good chance it’s going to be there again. Um, what they often don’t know is that, um, there is, you know, there’s nonaddictive medications that can be extremely effective. So we’ll start to go through that. So begin to, to create options for them. So when I think about what is success okay. What is success in anyone’s life is you’re going to run into problems.

David B. Livingston, LMFT: You are we all do. You’re going to have roadblocks. Your needs are going to at times feel like you don’t know what to do. So in a treatment, you’re constantly adjusting and coming up with creative ways that are healthy, as healthy as possible to meet those needs. So what you learn to do is think. You learn to take feedback from other people who you have confidence in and can trust because their feedback feels right to you. They’re hearing you correctly, and you begin to set up a system that allows for a feedback loop, right where, you know, um, you don’t feel trapped or stuck in anything for too long. Okay. And and so when that takes place and sometimes people are very lonely, and going to 12-step meetings is extremely helpful to them. And the support they’re so depending on what the need is, you know, you address that. And then when there’s more options, people do not feel trapped. They don’t feel stuck. And that is extremely helpful in all ways in life, particularly with, you know, get feeling compulsive.

Jaman Eley, LVN, SUDCC II, MATCC: Full agreement.

Clare Waismann, M-RAS/SUDCC II: I think, um, for me, success, you know, is self-growth. Um, we meet them where they are. We get them to a place where we reverse opioid dependence. And if they are able to keep that and work on their self-growth, regardless of how fast you know which path, regardless if they can grow every day a little, you know, to reach a healthier state of mind or a healthier physical state, then for me is already a success. It’s, you know, giving them the right foot forward to just grow.

Jaman Eley, LVN, SUDCC II, MATCC: Absolutely. I definitely am in full agreement with with both of you, as I often am. Um, I when when our clients come in, they have, uh, developed a plan. They have taken action on that plan. I’m sorry. Did I miss something? Oh, they have developed a plan. They’ve taken action on that plan and they’ve committed to something, and they’re doing it. And so that those small, measurable goals are going to set the tone for their success. So, uh, saying that they’re going to be with us for a week and completing that week, that’s a success. They’re, uh, taking the initiative to have a plan set up when they get home or have even a doctor’s appointment. That’s a success there. So we take those small, measurable goals, and they can move forward incrementally without them trying to tackle the next six months or the next year of their lives. And that’s important. Um, them believing in themselves, uh, them getting a full night’s sleep before they leave us. All of those things are successes. They believe that they can do it because ultimately, um, it’s on them. It’s for them. I tell people all the time, our success rates would be higher if we had enough staff to follow you around and slap that crap out of your hand, but we can’t. They’re going to be there. They’re going to be alone. They’re going to have to look at where they had come from and where they are now. And and they can do it if they believe that they can.

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: No. Very good.

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: Just didn’t want to step on David because I knew he was going to say something.

David B. Livingston, LMFT: Oh, no. No. Go ahead. Uh, I have a half-baked thought right now, but I’m just agreeing with with what you’re saying. You know, it is. They have to believe it. And then, um, um, you know, this is kind of a technical term. Uh, but one of the things I look for in terms of people’s success, although ultimately it was it was really what you’re all saying, which is growth, right? I mean, um, some sometimes people will say to me, I just want to be happy. And I look at them and I say, well, that’s a terrible goal. And, and they and they look at me like, shocked that a therapist is telling them that their goal isn’t to be happy. And I do remind him, I hope they have as much happiness as they possibly can have. And I do mean that. But that isn’t the goal, right? That’s part of what drives addiction. Because in reality, what we need is to be able to handle being fully alive. Because when you walk out the doors, you’re going to have to handle being fully alive. And as Jaman is pointing out, step by step, you don’t want to you don’t want people to get overwhelmed. You have to go slow enough and see what they can manage. And it varies because of a whole bunch of reasons. And so you go step by step and then people can grow if you go slowly enough and the plans are there and things take place, you know, and that’s really part of what a treatment is from my perspective, is you sort of create a pacing. You begin to deal with, you know, helping them lean into and be able to handle all the different sides of life. And hopefully they have as much joy and well-being as possible. Um, something like that.

Dwight Hurst, CMHC: Very well said. And we’ve got, as we said before, a wealth of expertise that comes to this podcast. Each time that we broadcast it, I myself, I carry out, uh, wonderful things that I learn each time, uh, that we do. And so, uh, very great talks today and very, very helpful to those that are out there for all of those of you that are out there that are listening to this, I hope that you will take some guidance from this and also share this with other people. One of the greatest things you can do to help those in your life, and those, whether you know them or not to, is to share these kinds of messages. So please share our message, whether it’s on the podcast platform where you watch it or through your social media. Please, please do that. Share that with other people. Um, this podcast is, of course, brought to you by Waismann Method Opioid Treatment Specialists and Rapid Detox Center. Uh, you can find us anywhere on social media @opiates generally, and you can also send us an email at info@opiates.com, or visit opiates.com the website to to learn more about it. Just want to give our our last reminder to everybody out there to keep asking questions. Because if you ask questions, you can find answers. And when you find answers, you can find hope. Thanks for being here, everybody. And and have a great day.

Jaman Eley, LVN, SUDCC II, MATCC: Thank you. Thanks so much.